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Wyat_hawke
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Hello all, to those who do not know me I am Wyat Hawke. I have a big passion for testing and inventing new builds to use, either for PvP or PvE. With that information in your backpack, I'm going to move on to the real issue.
Alright everyone, hands up to those who think they've seen the most ridicilous build ideas in RA. There are many different versions, and not everyone of them works. I'll admit I've used RA to test many of my builds, even those I would naturally assume was going to be a complete disaster. Something might look brilliant in your head, but fails completely when you go into the real game.
My problem here is, I have to go all the way through RA trying to test the build (this especially applies to all sorts of PvE builds). And I can imagine how extremely annoying it must be for those 3 other individuals to see the whole group lose just because of me, or any other person who tries out a new "test" build in RA. I know I get really annoyed when I see someone trying some utterly wasted combo. But can't really test it anywhere else, what shall we do?
The most natural thing to think about would be the Isle of the Nameless. Here you can find a wide variety of targets to practice on. But as always, there's something shattering that delusion.
And the big problem with the Isle is that it's simply to small and narrow-minded. It's a good start for those who are new to the game and PvP, but if you want to test something there, it really isn't the right place. In the Isle of the Nameless, you can Only
- Fight 1vs1 style against the Masters of *
- Hit dummies
That really doesn't work out completely. For PvP builds, the Masters work to some extend. But what if you want to try out a build that focuses on AoE damage, or a against a special build you can't find on that island? Then your lost. If you try to use the island for testing most PvE builds, your also lost. You simply don't see a Elementalist in PvE going 1vs1 against a enchantment removing warrior. There's many other excamples also, what if you want to try out a new monking build that doesn't target yourself? Or even more annoying, testing out a new version of a 55hp build or 1hp?
No, the Isle of the Nameless simply doesn't suit all those purposes. But yet, I don't want to go to RA and waste other peoples time? Perhaps that stupid n00bish smiter monk was just testing out a new way to farm sardelac sanatorium?
And besides, going to RA is also a rubbish way to try and test a build, even a PvP one. You don't have any clue what you will face, so you won't be sure if you'll even meet the foes your special build focuses on.
Indeed, it isn't easy. Testing out builds should be easier, and those going to RA shouldn't always have to worry about getting a bunch of people with their test builds. So perhaps someone could read through my post and say what they think? My suggestion is this:
Tester Arena
This place should be something like the Isle of the Nameless, although only separated into two parts. The first place would be something like the old Isle, where you have AoE-dummies, but these dummies (sheep, grawls or whatever) should be able to move out of the AoE skills. Being able to set their health bars and armour would also be great, so you can try and determine how much damage your build would do own an enemy. they should have something like the Masters on the Isle, a small circle they can move around in (about 1 and a half aggro circle perhaps?) If you have any other suggestions of what these moving dummies should be able to do, then please feel free to post it below.
Now for the second part, that is my real idea. Imagine this;
You are in an explorable area (just like the Isle), in a small locker or something alike. Below you, you can see a gladitors arena (a circled battleground). You can first set your own skills, attributes and so on while you are in this explorable area. I'm outmost tired of having to go back and fourth between the Great Temple and the Isle, just to change one single skill or an attribute point. I want to be able to do that while I'm in this certain explorable area, so I won't have to waste so much time. That's a bit off the point, let's continue here.
When you are satisfied with your skills and setup, you enter the arena (straightaway, no 15 seconds of waitning), where you fight against your own Hero's, the Hero's that YOU can decide should use what sort of skills.
Just imagine how much easier testing would be, if you could try out all sorts of combinations fast and easy, against the foes of your choice. Also, it's an marvellous way of trying to simulate a PvE fight. I know there are many PvE farming builds that require the farmer to be attacked (builds that utilizes energy management from skills like essence bond and such). I think you should have a maximum of 3 Heroes, just as in PvE. And perhaps even a way to give them either NM AI, or HM AI, who knows?
After the fight is over (if they die, you die, or you decide to cancel the fight) you return to back to your old position, in the locker. Now, if you wasn't completely satisfied you can then rearrange your skills, replace some or even try a new build. Things would be so much easier if we didn't need to teleport back and fourth from the Isle and the Temple (or from a RA battle, for that sake). I'm not sure how it would be to try and make a RA simulation (meaning, you get 2 extra NPC-teammates to fight off the 3 Hero's of yours), so any help would be appreciated.
In the end, it is those who go to RA who will benefit from it. If all people is going to the backyard to test out good/awful builds, it would make leave the better people off in RA. It won't remove ragequitters and "noobs", but atleast all the "try-and-completely-fail-at-the-exspense-of-others" would be gone. And after all, don't we all want that?
Cheers: Wyat (and forgive me for any spelling mistakes)
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| 05/21/07 11:46 |
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w0utje15
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That would be great, some sort of testers Arena with ur own Hero against you :D
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| 05/21/07 12:07 |
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kotaro
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This sounds like a really great idea! Im sure lots of people would benefit from something like this, I like to experiment too.
ANet! I hope that you see this!
^^Kotaro
"Oh, hi there! I'm that cool person you wish you were." :P
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| 05/21/07 12:10 |
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mwpeck
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The only problems with you idea, is game AI is nowhere close to matching that of a person.....so testing a build in RA would be much more effective than testing it against AI. BUT it would at least be able to give us an idea of "ok, this build should work in RA" or "Ok, no way this build will work in RA".
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| 05/21/07 12:24 |
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GW_Ranger
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I especially like the idea of being able to change skills/attributes on the fly. I've thought that the Isle of the Nameless should have that option, since it is basically just a 'testing' area.
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| 05/21/07 12:35 |
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Kickthebaby
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Wyat Hawke, whos Wyat Hawke?
Thats a good idea, I had a similar one but not so much on the PvP side of things. A place with no limits would be cool though, being able to kill everyone, minions that last forever, as many elites as you like and maybe spawning your own enemies. Its deffinatly something that should be looked at IMO, nice work.
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| 05/21/07 13:28 |
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Survivingsin
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Omg this is exactly what i been thinking for a while. i was thinking more like this:
For pve testing, any monster that you have killed (Bosses too and even bosses than are storyline bosses like glint) you can put into the arena. You can then take who ever is in your party and fight how ever many of that monster you want and kill it with your party up to 8. Also it could be a great place to test out solo builds so you can take for instance 20 trolls and kill them solo with an ele. Also it would be pretty cool to try to take on 2 Glints at once lol with a full team of course.
For Pvp There could be 2 things you can do. Practice dummies with certain enchantments on them and armor levels. They can be moving targets, stationary unaware and stationary AWARE targets, meaning if they are not knowing you are casting say SH and they react in about 2 seconds less. Also aware targets see you casting and respond like normal people (they move before its cast so they take no dmg)
Also like fighting series like Dead or Alive it can be they are set to do a specific thing such as attack, cast a certain spell(s), or run. Then you can practise using certain skills like bulls strike on foes or interupts.
Ooooo just thought of something, infusing practise. you could have it so that they would lose 90% of their health instantly then 2-1/2 seconds later they would die and you have to infuse in time. Then you can have it so you have a party of 4-6-8 and even 12 for advanced practise. Basically a good way to practise reaction times.
This is a great idea. I would post it on guild war.com forum .
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| 05/21/07 13:32 |
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aznese guy
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I really like this idea since I always test builds either in AB or RA. Yeah alot of them work but there are the ones that dont and why waste the people's time using a crap build in RA like u said. I would very much like to see this in game because it would benefit just about anyone for PvE or PvP! + cred
quit gw for good. end of story.
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| 05/21/07 13:54 |
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Xellois55
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Awesome idea, would make it alot easier to test builds, sure the AI are still blockheads, but atleast you can see if it works or not, if it works doesnt immediatly mean it works VS Humans, but you make a chance ;) (unless you face human blockheads that is)
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| 05/21/07 14:03 |
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hat-of-doom
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wouldn't it just be easier to scrim against someone to test it? or if you want to test it in groups HB it?
"Quis custodiet Ipsos custodes. - Who watches the watchmen?"
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| 05/21/07 14:08 |
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Xellois55
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| QUOTE | | wouldn't it just be easier to scrim against someone to test it? or if you want to test it in groups HB it? |
True, but i guess some people dont have guildies that have the time for that always, or perhaps some guildies lack skills needed for a good counter?
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| 05/21/07 14:11 |
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Wyat_hawke
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| QUOTE | wouldn't it just be easier to scrim against someone to test it? or if you want to test it in groups HB it?
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Dear Hat-of-doom, a scrim wouldn't be faster. Firstly you have the waiting, and secondly, if you want to test it against several enemies, that would also require several guildmates. I'm not sure about how your guildmates are, but I find it a bit hard to get 4-5 people to come around and start whacking at me, without waiting for them to finish that last quest, and so on.
And at Survivingsin, you point out some quite good ideas, thank you. However, there are challenge missions like Dragons Throat that can do almost that dead or alive scenery you imagined ^^
The point about the foes being AWARE of you or not however is a good one. We can solve that problem with hero's (attack, defend and avoid combat commands), but for the dummies that is also a good one.
Lastly, what is guild war.com forum? ^^
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| 05/21/07 14:16 |
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Wyat_hawke
Posts: 1459
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Hmmm, now that GW is down with error=13's I guess I can bump this topic so people might actually read it... Sorry for making my post so long >_>
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| 05/21/07 14:45 |
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Wyat_hawke
Posts: 1459
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EDIT;
Should I try and submit this to the Guild Wars support site?
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| 05/21/07 15:46 |
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Xellois55
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Probably read it here no?
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| 05/21/07 15:47 |
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Kickthebaby
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If youre going to try give it to Anet or what not, neaten it up a little, because its worth a shot.
Use bullet points, much easier to read than chunks of text.
Get a little more input from some friends, make sure youve got everything before you try.
Make sure its all reasonable and do-able, not beyond limits for Anet.
Cant think what else.
Btw GL
***THIS POST HAS BEEN EDITED***
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| 05/21/07 15:54 |
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